What are the general thoughts on the 2008v1 release so far? We have just started to use it and don't really see much new or improved. Are there any massive improvements?
Right now we are tryign to decide to renew our subscription or move on to another suite such as Telerik.
The Infragisitcs controsl have been ok and we have usedthem for years but overall they are very heavy for web use and more complex than they need to be. Support and sample code is also weak in our view.
marly,
Please see this blog entry from the Documentation Manager for an explaination of the Infragistics help file structure:http://blogs.infragistics.com/blogs/tom_puglisi/archive/2008/03/26/netadvantage-help-table-of-contents-explanation.aspxThis may help as you are learning. From your description of your experience it sounds like you've opened the help to the API section versus the top section Developers Guide which contains a large number of step by step tutorials.
You can download the PDF package of the Developers Guide and class diagrams in pdf format here:http://ko.infragistics.com/downloads/default.aspx?id=2620look for NetAdvantage for .NET 2008 Vol. 1 Documentation PDF on the page.
Hello Ambrose,
While I am all for code snippets I am unsure the forums are the best place for them. The knowledgebase offers a more condensed and formalized approach. However the knowledgebase needs some substantial revision and housecleaning of information dated back to 2002. Perhaps task some of those guys building Tangerine with a new version of the knowledgebase. I know sometimes the cobblers son is last to get new shoes.
Personally I believe the control that I use the most UltraWinGrid is much better documented than most of the others and perhaps can serve as a guide for the others. As well MikeS does a fantastic job of answering questions on the forum whereas on some of the others I have just been ignored.
I have only delved into Web programming once with your controls so I cannot comment on them although I found web programming in general a more frustrating effort than winforms and can appreciate those who endeavor to do such. Anything that can make learning and using the tools easier would be appreciated I am sure. One of the releases had a series of videos about new features which was very good however that hasn't seemed to be carried onward.
I can appreciate the tug-of-war that must go on because of all the new technologies being fostered by Microsoft. It seems the pace keeps accelerating. Although the documentation can be improved I must say after 30 years in this business it's so much easier now than trying to find the cause of an F0 General Fault in a thousand page manual.
Thanks,
Nick
Jason, Ambrose, et al
It should be obvious from these exchanges that the IG documentation is somewhat lacking, and does not match the quality of the actual controls. I do not feel that taking a 'us and them' antagonistic stance is not helpful, so please take the comments below as suggestions and opinions.
I am still favouring a searchable code snippet library as a means by which some short term benefit can be gained to plug the obvious gap in the documentation.
I do also agree that IG needs to put more effort into their documentation.
I have been involved in many large scale projects, some dealing with critical software such as aircraft control systems. As part of the final acceptance testing of these systems, personnel (who had not been involved in the development) were brought into the project to undertake this testing. This methodology always produced quick results in defining flaws in both the software and any documentation. I do not know how IG assigns staff to the production of the documentation, but I could suggest that they use a new recruit (graduate level ?) who has little understanding of IG controls, and simply get them to produce real world code using the IG controls and the documentation. Every time they had to ask for assistance should demonstrate some flaw in the documentation, which should be recorded as a need to enhance the documentation. This internal feedback coupled to someone keeping a close eye on the code snippets being uploaded by users, could provide a quick path to improving the documentation.
Having said all that, it should be obvious that the existing structure of the documentation (especially with regard to developers) is in need of dramatic change. IG must realise that their competitors are producing documentation that is superior in terms of ease of use, and new customers may well make purchasing descisions based largely on this factor.
I hope that IG do undertake a documentation review, as I feel that many of their controls are superior to other vendors. But be aware that the competitors are snapping at you heels. I would also like to see a slimming down of future controls, as many of the existing IG controls now have so many properties that without good documentation, searching the maze to find the one you want can be daunting.
So, in summary, redesign and improve the documentation, enable a contributable and searchable code snippet library, and produce more simple controls (e.g. new breadcrumbs control). Undertaking these actions would in my opinion make IG the leading control supplier. Not doing so, the danger is that some competitor will overtake you and steal market share.
Ambrose,
This would get my vote
Alex
Great replies so far, thanks to all the users and Infragisitics as well.
I think the main concern I have right now and have ben expressed by others are as follows:- Poor and dated documentation- Lack of real world samples- Poor support (9 times out of 10 the answer seems to be we don't know or understand the issue or we don't do that but make it a feature reqest, or worse yet, submit a bug ticket)- Lack of innovation in recent releases- Very heavy web controls
Infragistics looks great on paper but it seems to be more tailored towards what looks good in an ad or in a marketing pitch than it does on what works well in the real world. Sure the controls have laods of features, but I think the problem is they have too many that are actually refined, documented properly, and work well especially in a web environment. The smaples provided are so basic that once you throw real data at them and full functionality you start to see slowdowns and issues.
At this point I'm still leaning towards switching to Telerik and not renewing based on my experiences and comments here so far. They may have a lot of the smae issues but so far my communicatiosn with them have been 10X better than with Infragisitics (ie they actually reply with useful answers), they have a better community and interact with it, and the samples and documentation seem far better.