Are you kidding me lol... Telerik has nothing BUT problems, and what really makes me LMFAO is when you post something on Telerik forums you get the "FAMOUS" old Microsoft answer "We were unable to reproduce the problem must be on your end..." lol Telerik what a Joke...

I've tried to view this several times. never could see it. just now waited 20 minutes but it never loaded nor timed out.

that is weird as it works from several different server locations for me, are you using IE7?

Your challenge is very interesting reading.  I am glad it has gone from throwing trash to useful discussion.  I have been programming since you had to punch your Assembler code onto 80 column hollerith cards and it has always been difficult.  They were teaching that computers would program themselves by the 2000.  But who is going to re-boot them?? 

I have been through Assembler, COBOL, C, C++, IDEAL, Clipper, dBASE, Access, .NET.  All promised that it would be simpler to create systems.  Tis has been the software promise since the beginning of silicon chips.

Programming is not easy.  If it were just drag and drop we would not get paid the big $$ and not be as valuable to our employers.  There are many ways to accomplish the same goal so which one is "best"?  Like any language, you build your experience with these controls by using them over time.  To emphatically state that one is better or easier to use is the same as debating VB vs. C#.

I used Protoview and Sheridan before they became Infragistics.  The controls have grown up so much over time.  Adding the browser just makes it more of a challenge to develop controls that can be rendered with predictablility.  I don't know who is better but I view Infragistics kind of like Microsoft.  Infragistics set a standard and now others are using this standard to try and exceed what Infragistics has done.  In my opinion it is more difficult to blaze the trail than it is to find a better/faster trail.  Infragistics has set a standard and now Telerik is trying to raise the bar.  We should celebrate the healthy competition as it wiil force both companies to continue to improve.

My 2 cents.

Bob

"I am glad it has gone from throwing trash to useful discussion"

I think you made a mistake... it should be : "I am sad it has gone from useful discussion to throwing trash"!

The post was dedicated to warn people about bad stuff that IG did, preventing people like me to purchase a product that is not mature enough, full of bugs and bad support. I know Cris will argue, I'm able to make a nice application very quick bla bla bla... but you are the ONLY ONE! LOL. At least with Telerik you do not have a learning curve of month, nor years! You don't have to buy tranning on their product because they are easy to use. Remi has really a good point in the discussion when he said that a suit of controls that nobody can use except some "Elite" is not useful for anybody. The main goal to buy a suit of controls is to inscrease productivity, if it don't, it don't do the job, that's it!

I know Cris that you try to help people, that great, my post is not to *** the job you do! I' sure your site will be really helpful for many developpers (I really wish it to you) and congratulation if you are the infragistic's king!

So I do not really know where I'm gooing with my post so I'll shut up :)

@Cedric, I am not going to argue with you over mature, bugs, bad support etc. only to say I don't see how I can be the ONLY ONE that can do this minus the javascript for the new message notification 90% of that site is drag and drop so I am a little confused here... I don't think of myself as Uber Elite nor do I think I am the IG King and in my humble opion their are members on here that are A LOT better than me...

As far as my site it is not a control site and yeah I do pimp infragsitics as that is what I prefer and well it is my site so hehehehe but that aside I would be more than happy to do the same kind of tutorials in other controls but I am not going to go buy a control set just to make a tutorial...

@remi Man I could go for some wine right now so if you wouldn't mind touching this glass of water for me...

@michael

I get the frustration with the webcombo (grid) and not going to argue that, "however" my plan for the dropdown in the outlook demo is not going to use the webcombo (for that matter didn't even cross my mind to use it) but rather was going to use the igmenu that way not only could I list submenus "like in outlook" "Recent Searches->Search Results" but at the same time have menu options... :)

@John, I cannot argue with you there and I am in the process of writing a tutorial for that (and a js file) just been caught up with some other stuff (sorry about that i will try and get it done this week sometime)...

Here is the deal folks no one control solves 100% of the problem not Telerik not Infragistics none of them do this has been the case forever and is not going to change so the best you can do is make your own and/or use several different controls together (hopefully in harmony) but this also depends a lot on how much money you got and/or how much talent you have... There is no doubt that all companies have short comings and a lot of times programmers (egos) <--myself included get so caught up in their "favorite" controls that they will shout at the top of their lungs arguing what you would shout at the top of your lungs defending... debate can be a good thing and it can be a bad thing I see the outlook thing as nothing more than another programmer telling me I can't do something nothing more nothing less... is it counter productive sure, is it fun? well for me it is because it was a challenge and I like challenges... and while I could go around screaming that IG has me by the short and curlies I can say the same thing about Telerik as the problem I was having with the window control was fixed in promethous but that means i gotta upgrade to fix what I would think of as a major bug... but tomatoes, tamatoes  

Here is a perfect example of this: Intersofts Desktop is great no doubt about it you can tell they put a lot of time and effort into it, however it "does not" do some things I need it to do so I am having to rebuild it (hence the desktop challenge)... Would I have prefered to just write a tutorial on how to hook it up "you bet your ***" but I can't do that because those features don't exist so now i have to rebuild their control from the ground up...

"On a side note (and not to start a argument) I haven't used Telerik's "new" promethous schedule so I don't know what it can or can't do and I am not sure what limitations you are running into as I haven't come across any limitations in the webschedule it is actualy (in my opinion) one of the easier controls to work with..."

One of the main issues we have is not being able to drag and drop between days. The Infragistics web scheduler only handles drag/drop in the same day. The Telerik component fixes this. There are lots of other minor things but I guess my main complaint is I have no idea whether or not this will ever be fixed. I'm supposed to wait like a kid for christmas and then open up my present to see what I got! I'd rather have a roadmap so I know where I'm going!

I think what Chris is doing is great for the community. It will help those struggling with the IG controls to have a look at a real world application and through the tutorial learn how to acheive it. This can only be a good thing and I think Chris should be commended for doing it. However am I convinced that IG is great? and am I ready to buy the kneepads? Not just yet. Just as other people have posted, there are still some underlying issues with the IG controls that have alienated a lot of customers. There is a one way trend of people leaving IG and moving to Telerik and apparantly NOT the other way round. The real issue here (and to be productive) is to establish why the trend is happening and why customers feel so let down by IG. We could argue back and forth that Telerik is better blah blah blah, but this is an IG forum and I for one hope that this discussion and others alike would shed some light on what customers want and what they feel is lacking.

@Chris

your Outlook demo so far is impressive and it has raised (just a little) my perception of IG. However the standard IG webcombo is a bloated dropdown with a grid attached to it. This is just one of the controls that IG have done wrong. Why do I say that, well try to replicate the Outlook 2007 webcombo properly. You will notice that the original contains a dropdown menu. To achieve something like this in Telerik is a breeze as pretty much all their controls have templatable items. This means I can easily integrate pretty much any control as a template. I may be wrong so please enlighten me if I am.

"I was amused for a while but now I am tired of your rant."

 no one's forcing you to read any of this! :)